Petrov and Boshirov
- 1 Russians charged
- 2 'Petrov' and 'Boshirov'
- 3 Timeline in Salisbury
- 4 London
- 5 Bellingcat
- 6 Anatoly Vladimirovich Chepiga
- 7 Analysis
- Salisbury novichok poisonings: police name two Russian suspects -The Guardian, 5 September, 2018
- Salisbury Novichok poisoning: Two Russian nationals named as suspects -BBC, 5 September, 2018
- В МИД РФ заявили, что данные обвиняемых по "делу Скрипалей" россиян ни о чем не говорят - Interfax, 5 September, 2018
- Zakharova: The names published in the media, or the photos, do not tell us anything.
- EXCLUSIVE: Chilling CCTV footage shows the novichok assassins calmly strolling through Salisbury and window-shopping for vintage COINS just moments after nerve agent attack -Daily Mail; 'A video with "poisoners" of the Skripals published' (video) - Rusvesna, 6 September, 2018
- A shop on 42 Fisherton, some 500 meters east of the train station, towards the city and away from Skripal's home which is west of the train station (shown on Daily Mail map)
- Noted. Petrov has a back-pack, squarish, with something in it. Boshirov is bagless.
- Social media users observations
Александр Баширов (Alexander Bashirov) -well known actor ("Cat-Behemoth", Master and Margarita). Alexander Petrov is like John Smith, generic (eg an actor here) --Resup (talk) 12:12, 5 September 2018 (UTC)
- Counter-terrorism police release images of two suspects in connection with Salisbury attack -Met Police, 5 September, 2018
- On Sunday, 4 March, they made the same journey from the hotel, again using the underground from Bow to Waterloo station at approximately 8.05am, before continuing their journey by train to Salisbury.
- That brings them to Salisbury at about 9.46 am (or later). Train takes 1:22 to 1:33 (hr:min), so immediately getting on a train will bring them to Salisbury at 9:27; present Sunday schedule has it arriving 9:46 (somehow it took them 2 h 40 min the day earlier, 11:45 to 2:25 pm; unfamiliar/needed help to make the transfer?)
- And Skirpals left the house, when? Sergei's car is seen in the area of London Road, Churchill Way North and Wilton Road about 9.15am--here, and here.
- March 4, arrived after Skripals left the house? Then what? --Resup (talk) 22:20, 5 September 2018 (UTC)
- Video played on BBC: left Salisbury station 11:48 am (what took them so long? 8:05 appears to be time of arrival to Waterloo, not departure from the City Stay hotel, 94 Bow Road; even in the latter case, it's extra 30 min on the tube). Wilton Road ('near Skripal house'), 11:58 am . Fisherton St, Salisbury 13:05 and 13:08 pm (it's midway between Zizzi and train station, some 5 min walk to either). Salisbury station (CCTV), 13:45. Back at Waterloo station, London, 4:45 pm . So gone from Salisbury, not later than 3:15 pm (with apparent 3 hours train journey time, unexplained). Skripals in Zizzi restaurant , 2:40 to 3:40 (here). So , when and where they were poisoned?
- BBC is saying that it is believed poisoning happened at Skripal home, via doorknob, at about 12 pm. But (1) British victims apparently had much quicker effect; near-simultaneous action on two different adults (kicking in quite fast after a long delay) is unlikely (2) it is not shown that Skripals were back at home, after leaving by 9:15 and spotted in town at 13:30
- Investigation update – 22 November 2018 -Counter Terrorism Policing \ Salisbury & Amesbury Investigation. Includes 3 new short video clips.
'Petrov' and 'Boshirov'
- To Alexander Petrov and Ruslan Boshirov - by Alexey Venediktov, Ed. Ch., Echo Moskvy, 7 September, 2018
- Mr. Alexander Petrov and Mr. Ruslan Boshirov, if you have something to respond to the accusations of the British authorities, the radio station Ekho Moskvy is ready to provide you with its broadcast.
- Andrei Piontkovsky: Lugovoi and Kovtun saved themselves by running to Echo and going public.
- Instagram, 7 September, 2018
- Dear journalists, information on Boshirov living in our house is incorrect. Please do not disturb our house residents! Administration.
- Russian/British journalist Sergey Brilev asks Putin about Boshirov and Petrov, receives the answer (video)(we looked into it, found them, there is nothing to it, best if they will come over and tell themselves, nothing criminal, they are civilians), 12 September, 2018
- Александр Петров пообещал дать комментарий по делу Скрипалей (Aleksandr Petrov promised to comment on Skripals' affair) - Vesti/Russia-24 , 12 September, 2018
- Aleksandr Petrov (to Russia-24 correspondents): 'No comment so far. Maybe next week.'
- RT editor-in-chief’s exclusive interview with Skripal case suspects Petrov & Boshirov (TRANSCRIPT), RT, September 13, 2018 video
- What they say about weather, in general checks out, though I am not sure about particular conditions in particular places, and how trains were running. Feel stupid that did not make the connection with big train delays; just not used to state of affairs when snow has big effect on transport --even hearing about that this is the case --Resup (talk) 15:26, 13 September 2018 (UTC)
Reward for info offered
- 100 тысяч рублей за информацию о Петрове и Боширове: «Комсомольская правда» объявляет вознаграждение для читателей (100 thousand rubles for info about Petrov and Boshirov - 'Komsomoslkaya Pravda' announces reward for readers)-Komsomoslkaya Pravda , 14 September, 2018
- Wanted are those familiar with "tourists from Salisbury" who can confirm or refute their story.
Petrov-I and Petrov-II
There is a speculation (eg Sharii) that Alexander Petrov #1, who essentially said that he has nothing to do with it, who was covered by media in early September (said to be born 13 July, 1979, said 1, 2 to work as a Head of the site in the Tomsk branch of NPO (scientific-industrial association) "Microgen" - Scientific-Industrial Association "Virion" ) ---is the same Petrov who gave an interview to Margarita Simonian on camera. This is not really clear, but there is a brief audio fragment of Petrov #1 where he says, answering a question whether it is just a coincidence that his name and date of birth being the with the person featured by the British, around 1.11 here: Da konechno Mne by do Altaya doehat, = Yes, of course. I had difficulty even going to Altai (lit. I wish I would be able to go to Altai). By ear, some similarity in voice, inconclusive; probably computer matches will not be very reliable either. --Resup (talk) 10:31, 2 October 2018 (UTC)
2014 visit to Czech Republic?
- Dvojitého agenta Skripala v Česku tajně sledovali stejní lidé, které Britové podezírají z jeho otravy -Irozhlas, 10 October, 2018
- He arrived in the Czech Republic - just under the name of Petrov - in the middle of October 2014. More precisely: from October 13th to October 16th he was staying in one of the Ostrava hotels. He then moved to Prague....The other, under the name of Ruslan Boşhirov... On October 11, 2014, he visited Prague.
- Третий русский. В деле Скрипаля могут появиться новые фамилии-Fontanka.ru, 10 October, 2018
Searching for Petrov and Boshirov
Set-up: assume that Petrov and Boshirov are telling the truth. Find evidence of their (civilian, = non-'services') business.
Present status: no clear-cut confirming evidence found so far. Rejecting evidence will not come about in those type of searches.
Some attempts below (posted in hope that someone can do a better job than this, which turns inconclusive):
- Individual entrepreneur Petrov Alexand in Moscow, use https://egrul.nalog.ru/ or https://zachestnyibiznes.ru/, quite long list of results, with different middle names (our guy's, unknown). Some possibles among those listed, but clear-cut match not identified. Boshirov Ruslan, nothing found in Moscow or St. Petersburg. ON zachestnyibiznes.ru , no Boshirov found (anywhere), and too long list (11636) on Petrov Alexandr, with some somewhat possibles (retail trade not in stores, stalls, markets) early on, but nothing clear-cut identified.
- Nutrition consultations in Moscow on profi.ru. 188 specialists records. Results inconveniently formatted , 20 names per screen, going through those (lazily) not resulted in Petrov or Boshirov
- Shaping halls and clubs, -nutrition specialists: 6 clubs in Moscow, 7 in St Petersburg, but this does not give individual names of specialists, only legal venues
'Ex-employee of the GRU told who Petrov and Boshirov really are'-MK, September 16, 2018
- the main question is not whether they are murderers or gay tourists. The main question is whether they are really Petrov and Boshirov. Because it may well be this: the British secret services recorded two people whom they considered to be liquidators, and the Russian authorities quickly found two similar ones, which they “appointed” Petrov and Boshirov. Judging by the fact that they write about the numbers of their passports and "secrecy" designations on their documents, they did not go far, they took two people who, due to their service, cannot disobey the order.
- Real liquidators always get high-quality documents. They never go on assignment with documents from their own country, even if they are fake.
- The GRU does not use random people as liquidators. Anyway, that's how it used to be. Well, the idea that these are real GRU officers who failed the task and for this they were appointed gays is, of course, completely absurd.
- if these two are really intelligence officers, if they are really involved in an attempt to eliminate Skripals, this means that the whole structure has failed completely ('got covered with a copper basin'). And this is really scary.
- There is a version about which little is said, but which, in my opinion, may well turn out to be real: the whole story of the Skripals is not about “revenge of the state”, but about “revenge of the mafia”. They wrote that Skripal was associated with the Russian mafia in Spain and that at the same time he worked for Spanish intelligence. If the mafia undertook to eliminate him, then these miscalculations are easily explained, as well as the choice of a poisonous substance. In recent years, in the field of the protection and transportation of highly toxic substances, there is a complete mess, they are easily channeled across different countries and structures, primarily criminal ones. It is also possible that the Russian leadership is not very interested in investigating just such a “mafia” scheme - that's why it 'sculpts' it quickly. Looking for "Petrov and Boshirov"? Well, here are Petrov and Boshirov, ordinary gays, and then you decide for yourself whether to believe them or not. It cannot be ruled out that even suspicions towards the intelligence structure for some reason do not frighten the leadership so much as the possibility that the British will take on real performers and real reasons. There is, by the way, the option that Petrov and Boshirov were not the liquidators, but performed some kind of intermediate function: they observed, for example, and transmitted information to real liquidators.
Timeline in Salisbury
- To do!
- Novichok suspects' drug-fuelled night of 'cannabis and prostitutes' at £75-a-night East London hotel just hours before Salisbury attack - Daily Mail, September 16, 2018
- A guest who recognised the pair from CCTV images released by police told the newspaper: ‘I could smell weed from their room. It was by the door and in the corridor, it was unmistakable. It must have been around 7pm. ‘Later there was a woman in there. I think she was a prostitute. They were having sex. Definitely. I heard them having really loud sex for a long time. ‘It was definitely a woman. I don’t think the men were having sex with each other.’
- Russian agents romped with prostitutes and smoked drugs before Salisbury Novichok attack - Express, September 16, 2018
- Criticism by Liane Theuer
- Skripal Suspects Confirmed as GRU Operatives: Prior European Operations Disclosed -Bellingcat, September 20, 2018
- Солберецкие, часть третья. «Бошировым» оказался «Герой России», полковник ГРУ Анатолий Чепига -Insider; Skripal Suspect Boshirov Identified as GRU Colonel Anatoly Chepiga -Bellingcat, September 26, 2018
- ФСБ ищет тех, кто «слил» анкеты Петрова и Боширова -Rosbalt, September 25, 2018
- “The true identity of one of the Salisbury suspects has been revealed to be a Russian Colonel. I want to thank all the people who are working so tirelessly on this case,” (Sec. State for Defence & MP) Gavin Williamson said in a tweet, which was later deleted without explanation.
- Bellingcat posts a new portrait of Chepiga, similarity is questionable. --Resup (talk) 20:26, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
- Skripal Suspect Boshirov Identified as GRU Colonel Anatoliy Chepiga - Bellingcat, September 26, 2018
- «Петровым» оказался военный врач из ГРУ Александр Мишкин. Подробности — завтра в расследовании The Insider и Bellingcat-Insider, October 8, 2018
- Second Skripal Poisoning Suspect Identified as Dr. Alexander Mishkin - Bellingcat, October 8, 2018
- Отравление Скрипалей: Bellingcat назвал фамилию второго подозреваемого. Кто он? -BBC Russian Service, October 9, 2018
- The BBC was able to communicate with Loiga native Denis Krasnov, who studied with Mishkin in the same school. He recognized Mishkin and in photos from his passport, which on the eve, on October 8, was published by Bellingcat and The Insider publications, and in a photo from Petrov’s British visa, published earlier by the British authorities.
- Noted, showing both photos infers that they are of the same person, so that somebody who knew him in school days and believing that younger passport photo is the same person will be lead to assume that Salisbury's Petrov is the same person too. This is not a proper way to establish whether Mishkin is Petrov.
- His other compatriot named Marina Ciobanu heard about the resident of Loiga Alexander Mishkin. However, she could not identify him from a photograph, referring to the fact that she had long since left the village. “I studied with him in the tenth grade, but left without finishing [the Loiginsky school],” said to BBC another resident Veronica Rotaru-Balte about Mishkin. Another resident of Loiga, Nikolai Tulinov, also told the BBC that he recognized Mishkin in a photograph of Petrov and that he lived in Loiga.
- Skripal Poisoning Suspect’s Passport Data Shows Link to Security Services - Bellingcat, September 14, 2018
- Bellingcat показал заявку на паспорт Петрова из Солсбери. На ней есть пометка от спецслужб -BBC Russian service, September 14, 2018.
- Alleged document is published, with a photo and partially blacked out text. "The " Insider ", the first to receive the documents, writes that they were provided by a source from the Russian police. The BBC can not confirm the authenticity of the documents. Two sources working in the FMS (the service was disbanded in 2016, its powers were transferred to the Ministry of Internal Affairs), the BBC reported that documents of this form - No. 1P - are actually filed when replacing and issuing a Russian passport."
Investigation into illegal access to information?
- 'Why did the siloviki help uncover Petrov and Boshirov. The co-author of the investigation explains' -currenttime.tv, September 27, 2018
- FSB is looking for those who handed questionnaires of Aleksandr Petrov and Ruslan Boshirov, and because of that, offers "to ring some people through the databases" disappeared, Rosbalt sources assert. Sergei Kanev, a journalist at the Dossier Center and co-author of an investigation into the alleged poisoners Sergei Skripal, learned that the department M of the Federal Security Service of Russia (anti-corruption in law enforcement agencies - NV) conducts a pre-investigation check. Kanev believes that he can become a defendant, if after the verification the case is still filed ...Sergei Kanev confirmed to NV that the sources of his investigation were active members of the security services. "I turned to my sources, including the Interior Ministry and the FSB, when I checked all the data, I do not think they will be discovered, these guys are not fools either," Kanev said.
History of producing fakes
- 'Uncorruptable from the 'Novaya Gazeta', by Alexander Rogers, Pressgrad.ru, November 20, 2018
- 'Going after the messenger' (Sergey Kanev) article. Receiving foreign funding has to be declared in Russia and is possibly illegal, but it is not something for us to care. What really concerns us here is reported history of producing fakes. Refers to publications about 'Secret agreement between NKVD and Gestapo' in the 1990's. This appears to be a proven fake, see here. 'Pamyat' (Memory), said to produce or contribute to the fake, is a group active in 1980-1990s, with an established reputation of being anti-semitic. Alexander Rogers is a journalist, I recon from Ukraine, now in Russia, who specializes in publications supporting the line of the Russian government.
- 'Soviet Story': the mechanism of a lie, by historian A. Diukov, published by Regnum, Moscow, 2008
- The new “General Agreement” was put into circulation through the journalist of NTV, Sergey Kanev, who specialized in the criminal chronicle. As Kanev himself argued, “the person who brought this folder reported that the document is authentic, from L. Beria’s personal archive.” The new version of the “General Agreement” differed significantly from that published in the Pamyat (Memory) newspaper.
- "I do not want to give the country to Boshirovs". Sergey Kanev - about his investigations and departure -Radio Freedom, October 2, 2018
- Describes his role in Boshirov investigation.
- Critical thinking as a way to maintain informational hygiene at the proper level, by Alafcreator, November 28, 2018
"Seregei Fedotov/Denis Sergeev"
Those BS persons seem to overdo themselves here. Right on the back of Putin-May at G-20, we got:
- Skripal poisoning: Third Russian suspect 'commanded attack' - Mark Urban/BBC, June 28, 2019
- The GRU Globetrotters: Mission London -BC, June 28, 2019
There are huge and obvious problems with all that stuff.
- (1) Even accepting every word they say, this does not establish anything, no link is established of this third "suspect" to Novichok, or Skripal, or the other two "suspects"
- (2) Bellingcat obtained the telephone metadata records from a whistleblower working at a Russian mobile operator, who was convinced s/he was not breaching any data privacy laws due to the fact that the person to whom this phone number was registered (“Sergey Fedotov”) does not in fact exist. I can smell a rat here. Such a naive wetlips with Russian phone metadata they got. Due to their history of collaboration with cutthroat 'yellow' journos not exactly famous for reliability but regularly producing 'roasted' stories fitting preexisting agenda, like the 'Insider' et al, I have serious doubts that the data is not forged. Conviniently, now none of the data is presented, so we are supposed to believe --the Bellingcat??? With their past pseudo-evidence not exactly showing what they claimed it shows?
- (3) Even less evidence that "Sergeev" is a general-major, or in active service. (They do not know which hotel at Paddngton, but know that he went every day to 3 GRU buildings? -etc; what this has to do with Skripal, etc. )
- (4). There are tons of Amirs in Moscow, a private company , a thief-in-law from the Caucuses , etc. --Resup (talk) 23:07, 28 June 2019 (UTC)
Anatoly Vladimirovich Chepiga
- "Clever, good, smart" "Kommersant" spoke with fellow villagers of Colonel Anatoly Chepiga - Komersant.ru, 27 September, 2018
- Not listed as a Hero of Russian Federation here, here (Checked 27 September, 2018). (Listed on Russian Wikipedia, but the article about him is created 16:39, 26 September 2018). Peskov: 'I do not have information that a person with such name was awarded'; avoids further comments on substance.
- dosaaf28.ru , 14 January, 2018
- Героем можно стать и в наше, казалось бы, мирное время. Уроженец с. Николаевка, выпускник ДВОКУ 2001 года Чепига Анатолий Владимирович, трижды был в командировке в Чечне, имеет более 20 наград и знаков отличия. А в декабре 2014 года полковнику Чепиге А.В. за выполнение миротворческой миссии присвоено звание Героя Российской Федерации.
- Чепигу-Боширова, обвиняемого в отравлении Скрипалей, односельчане помнят. Мы там побывали-BBC Russian service, 29 September, 2018
- Similar to Kommersant, no clear identification, but article title creates an impression there is. No breakthroughs.
- The Strange Russian Alibi - Craig Murray, September 13, 2018
- RT Interview with the “suspects” in the Skripal poisoning case - Gilbert Doctorow, September 13, 2018
- Russia is better at propaganda than we are - CNN, September 14, 2018
- SVR col. in reserve Yurii Totrov- 'Den' TV', youtube, 25 Sept. 2018
- (1)Alleges: 'There was no poisoning', 'nobody saw them poisoned' , 'it is artificially maintained', etc. (2) Says: 'look at the biography of Gina Haspel', and expands on her + UK PM biographies (3) 'those who want to consider them GRU, like our 5-th column, would be happy to do so' (main points briefly entered for research/reference/completeness purposes; FWIW).