Crash of Malaysia Airlines flight MH17/Investigation
UN Security Council
Resolution 2166 adopted on July 21, 2014:
- Supports efforts to establish a full, thorough and independent international investigation into the incident in accordance with international civil aviation guidelines;
- calls on all States to provide any requested assistance to civil and criminal investigations related to this incident;
- Calls on all States and actors in the region to cooperate fully in relation to the international investigation of the incident,
- Demands that those responsible for this incident be held to account and that all States cooperate fully with efforts to establish accountability;
The resolution fails to demand that the investigation is transparent.
- Security Council Coalesces around Resolution 2166 (2014) on Malaysian Jet Crash Demanding Accountability, Full Access to Site, Halt to Military Activities - Security Council, 21 JULY 2014
- Wikipedia: United Nations Security Council Resolution 2166
In July 2015 the UN Security Council tries but fails to declare the downing a criminal act.
- Security Council fails to adopt proposal to create tribunal on crash of Malaysian Airlines flight MH17 - UN, 29 July 2015
Dutch Safety Board
According to the DSB these 7 states participate in the investigation: The Netherlands, Malaysia, Ukraine, the Russian Federation, the United Kingdom, the United States, and Australia.
- Investigation crash MH17, 17 July 2014 Donetsk – Dutch Safety Board, 21 Aug 2014
- Final report released on October 13, 2015
- No longer accessible on 27 Aug., 2016.
- Safetyboard.nl carries the report plus appendices (link updated and works, as of 27 Aug., 2016)
Federal Air Transport Agency of Russia response and attachments (Word); Ruaviaton.com (dated January 14, 2016 on the web site)
- Many issues raised with final report, including too much weight loss and deformation of fragments still having bow shape, inadequate model of warhead fragment angles and velocities (different from manufacturer), issues with fuselage damage used for warhead positioning (some known hits ignored, grazing hits not taken into account properly), fuse engagement algorithm not taken into account, etc. Concludes that launch area was incorrectly calculated in the final report; that missile had to cross the path at an angle of at least 50-60 degrees, with the best location (if that was Buk at all) placed near Zaroshenskoe.
Official letter on MH17 investigation by top Russian aviation official Oleg Storchevoy, 9 Feb, 2016
- Russia angered by Dutch probe, New Straits Times, October 11, 2015
- In a scathing letter to the International Civil Aviation Organisation (ICAO), Oleg Storchevoy, Russia’s deputy director of the Federal Air Transport Agency and accredited representative in the international investigation team into the MH17 tragedy, accused the DSB of ignoring “comprehensive information” relating to the investigation provided by the Russian side.
- DUTCH REPORTS ON MH17 HAVE MISTAKEN BUK MISSILE MODEL, WARHEAD TYPE — THE FOOTNOTE WHICH PUTS THE BOOT TO BUK, John Helmer, October 16, 2015
- The TNO conclusions on the detonation have been cited by the NLR for substantiating its conclusions on the missile which brought MH17 down. NLR’s conclusions are the substantiation which DSB cites for its conclusions for the cause of the crash. So the DSB spokesman, Sara Vernooij, was asked from what source did the DSB obtain the parameters of the missile and warhead which have become the evidence for the DSB’s determination that a Buk missile was the sole cause of the MH17 crash. Vernooij said the DSB will not answer. “If it’s not in report, it is not to be released,” Vernooij said.
- Best = worst? Appendix Y calls for 'negligible damage on the right wing as one of assessment points (why the right wing?), as well as for 'warhead fragment elements' damage on the left nacelle. Figure A7, based on Almaz -Antey theory, show damage on left nacelle and left wing; yet is declared the poorest match (A2 -table A1). The 'best' one, Figure A4, gives some hits on the right wing. It is noted by Almaz-Antey that left wing and nacelle damage is caused by pre-formed elements and not by other missile parts--traces are of few (maybe 8) millimeters size, and there was penetration deep into the engine; at a distance 20 m, that may only be caused by preformed elements.
Joint Investigation Team (JIT)
The Dutch, Ukrainian, Australian and Belgian governments have announced that the JIT is bound by its founding agreement on August 7, 2014, to keep confidential the evidence it has been finding.
- Presentation preliminary results criminal investigation MH17 28-09-2016
MH17: Four charged with shooting down plane over Ukraine -BBC, June 19, 2019
- JIT accused Strelkov, Dubinskii (Khmuryi), Pulatov (Giurza), Kharchenko (Krot)
- Strelkov: “Opolchenie did not shoot the Boeing down. I do not give any comments regarding this tragedy, as well as about the course of the investigation of this case" (Rusvesna and social media, June 19, 2019).
- Strelkov: I like the Dutch ... I listened to the audio recordings of the allegedly "exposing" negotiations "on the case" - and I still do not understand it - what does the Boeing have to do with it?
- Well, let's say I asked Aksenov for help - tanks, anti-tank artillery and air defense weapons. Well, let's say, I spoke from Donetsk (and from where else?). So what?
- Did I hide something in this regard? That I contacted Aksyonov, or that I asked for help — including military — from the Russian Federation? No. Requested. They did not give it. So, what is next?
- Pulatov response to those presenting themselves as JIT is published, Cassad and links there. Cassad also posts earlier Pulatov social media post from 2014, which describes his actions to secure site and preserving evidence, and ending with: PS. and by the way, we know how to clean up after ourselves, unlike some idiots, "loudly" writing what was dictated to them PPS (introductory word meaning in general, to add, by the way) at that moment (he means MH17 crash) we were located in the area of Stepanovka, and we had Strela 10...contrails from Snezhnoe were not observed...from observers of aerial (activity of the) opponent, reports came about two altitude (=aerial) targets... later that one plane attacked the other and shot it down...the place of the fall was being clarified on the go (=as the events unfolded).
- I have not seen the above social media post of Pulatov myself. There are details on where to search but it will take a while and I do not have time.
- I have seen social media post of Khmuryi denying his role, and he also once contacted Western media with a denial (BBC Russian service). We have a related discussion here. --Resup (talk) 13:54, 22 June 2019 (UTC)
Witness - JIT MH17 Press conference, Wednesday 19, 2019 – requesting military support (NL) -Polite, June 19, 2019
Strelkov denies the accusations on several further occasions, including:
- Igor Strelkov on popular unrest, the Donbas, construction of the RNG and Navalny - Part 1 / Rozanov Club, around 54:30
- Strelkov:...and I want to say, looking you straight in the eye, in your face, that accusations of shooting down the Boeing, this has not to do with (literally for) me, not to do with ("for") me
- and not (to do at all with) the people named there , AT ALL
- I. Strelkov, V. Kvachkov, K. Sivkov, M. Kalashnikov: what to do? (p. 3), around 12:31
- Strelkov... Any fool knows that opolchenie did not shoot the Boeing, including over there [=in Holland].
- Sivkov: so , you have ignited the missile with a candlewick?
- Strelkov: no, it was with a slingshot, I used a special ballistic slingshot. Sivkov: aha, the one which shoots 10 km up
- Strelkov: moreover, I am sure that the Dutch understand very well, more than that, they know , the stupidity and senselessness of this accusation. But now, they threw the bait (забросили удочку-'threw the fishing rod')(gestures to imitate a fishing rod move), and they say, take this bait! handle him to us! Like in that movie, "Impossible to change the meeting place", give it to us, for tearing him apart, that musorok (derogative -policeman) --and we will forgive you! (=forgive Russia/the Russian top leadership). Of course they will not forgive, this is just a pretext, a trickery. But what if somebody will take the bait? This is a big temptation for our "well-loved" administration, to pretend that they believe, and take the bait (..etc)
- --Resup (talk) 16:38, 13 July 2019 (UTC)
Press conference, offer to do experiment
Almaz-Antey press conference, 13.10.2015.
- MH-17: fragments were moving along the plane, not perpendicular -seen from spangouts damage, while some ricochet damage on fuselage skin can be seen in the pilot cabin area
- Two experiments, to confirm previous modeling: (1) based on Almaz-Antey assumption, arriving almost perpendicular from Zarochenskoe (aluminum plates used as targets) (2) International investigation assumptions, arriving from Snezhnoe (IL-86 nose part, and aluminum target representing left engine). 9M38M1 missile used in the second experiment.
- In (1) version, fragments were moving along the plane, as predicted, and left engine area received damage
- In (2) version, it can be seen on high speed camera, around 49:56 time mark on video, that right side area is penetrated by high velocity fragments; one right window is broken, another had holes in it (windows are reinforced and thick). Those fragments will damage right engine and wing. Left engine target received no damage.
- Damage field looks similar, with appropriate choices made; but direction of fragments is almost perpendicular in the two versions.
- Clear double-T (='bow-tie'; = 'butterfly') shaped holes are seen. Those fragments will be 1/4 of all 7000 fragments, and double T holes will be seen, no matter what the angle is.
- 3 different types of elements overall, double-T, square, and small squarish inserts--the latter not found. Double T mass is 8.1 grams, and fragments will loose not more than 8% of the mass, or else will be unrecognizable.
- Older 9M38 missile was used, last produced in 1986. It was past expiration date and decomissioned in Russia
- Rocket engine will run for 18 seconds, the rest of 40 second flight is not engine-powered.
Presentation looks solid, some questions previously raised were answered.
- English language slides of presentation: /doc/284722224/Slideshow-van-Almaz-Antey (Viewer link) (Dropbox link)
- English language summary of findings: /doc/284718444/Resultaten-Almaz-Antey
(both on a site that is for some reason blocked by the spam filter: scribd DOT com)
- What Happened to Flight MH17? - blog
- How the Malaysian "Boeing" was shot down (translated by Cassad English)
- (Cites us: Talk:Crash of Malaysia Airlines flight MH17/Forensics)
- Original: В обломках MH17 найден стержень от ракеты "воздух-воздух" Р-60М (Rod from R-60M air-to-air missile found in the wreckage of MH17) - evanesce_girl, 1 March 2015
- Сенсационное расследование: "Боинг" все-таки сбила Украина (Sensational investigation: "Boeing" still hit by Ukraine) - politonline, 3 March 2015
- MH 17 – Abschuss durch ukrainische SU 25 ist bewiesen (MH 17 - fired from Ukrainian SU 25 is proved)- Peter Haisenko, AnderweltOnline, March 7, 2015
- MH17: Тайна правого борта - evanesce_girl, April 27th, 2015
- Это был «Бук-М1» (Report of Expert Engineers) - Novaya Gazeta, May 5, 2015
- Отчёт о крушении Boeing 777 МН-17 - Альберт Лекс (albert_lex), 2015-07-14
- Российский союз инженеров: реконструкция атаки на «Боинг» (Russian Union of Engineers: reconstruction of the attack on the "Boeing") – August 31, 2014
- "MH17 - Call for Justice" - Bonanza Media, YouTube, published on Jul 16, 2019, includes interviews with Khmuryi; with Malaysian PM; some other witnesses; analysis of one of the first audios posted by SBU; and other material.
- MH-17: In Search of Truth - UKR LEAKS, December 20, 2019 (video)
- The Many Reasons to Believe Vasily Prozorov’s Testimony About Ukraine’s Role in Downing MH-17 - Whitney Webb, Mint Press, March 27, 2019
- Former Ukrainian intelligence officer Vasily Prozorov’s testimony will likely be dismissed by Western governments that support Kiev, but there is plenty of evidence to back his claims.
- Ukranian Whistleblower Reveals MH-17 Tragedy Was Orchestrated by Poroshenko and British Secret Service - InfoBrics, The Duran, January 7, 2020
- The Many Reasons to Believe Vasily Prozorov’s Testimony About Ukraine’s Role in Downing MH-17 - Whitney Webb, Mint Press, March 27, 2019
- MH17- And do you still think the Buk has downed the airliner? Opinion of Yuri Antipov.-Sergey Grigoriev, Yandex Zen, June 13, 2020
- Noted: highlights of an investigation by Yuri Antipov supporting an explosion on board theory. Main text, photo 1: "A fragment of the container's power frame melted from local and very high temperature", among "wreckage near the village of Rassypnoye, where the front of the aircraft fell, including part of the front cargo compartment. There was no fire in this place of the fall of MH17." Photo 2, "the МН17 internal fastener , when sprayed with a gray-white substance, began to melt." Noted, provided description is consistent with provided photos; however an explosion on board as the accident cause is not consistent with other evidence such as photos showing damage by high velocity fragments in plane body, frame, the engine, and pilot bodies -- as reported by investigators. Reasons of such significant discrepancy are not known. Present location/custody of described wreckage and first date of publication of those photos is unclear.
Secondary sources on investigations
- Bundesregierung zu Flug MH17: Keine "gesicherten Erkenntnisse" über Abschuss – Rainer Leurs, Der Spiegel, Sept 7, 2014
- Russia proposes appointing UN special envoy for MH17 crash probe — Churkin – ITAR-TASS, 20 Sept 2014
- MH17: Duitse regering erkent indirect dat Oekraïne schuldig kan zijn (MH17: German Government indirectly admits that Ukraine may be guilty) – JDreport, 12 Oct 2014
- MH17-Chief Investigator Investigates Possibility of Air-to-Air Missile, Seeks Cooperation From Russia – Mish's Global Economic Trend Analysis, October 29, 2014
- Spiegel Online interviews Fred Westerbeke, the Dutch lead investigator of flight MH17 crash.
- “They are playing tennis—three sets every match to try and kill us.” – Col. Tulip, Slavyangrad.org, October 28, 2014
- Dutch government refuses to reveal ‘secret deal’ into MH17 crash probe – RT, November 20, 2014
- Malaysia must take leading role in MH17 investigations, says Suaram - Nation – The Star Online, November 22, 2014
- "The government should not put up with being sidelined in the (criminal) investigations. The airliner belonged to Malaysia, a big group of the victims were Malaysian," said Kua.
- Malaysia Airlines Flight MH17 Investigation: Trail of Guarded Secrets, Phil Butler, Epoch Times, December 10, 2014
- Tries an investigation into the investigation and runs into a wall of silence, with some exceptions like Dutch MP Pieter Omtzigt. Says Omtzigt:
- “…As to the intel, it is worth noting that both sides do not put the evidence on the table. That is worrying. This is one of the most closely guarded spots on the earth in terms of eavesdropping, satellite monitoring and much else from two sides (Russia and United States with allies). Both sides know a lot more that they are willing to share with the world community.”
- Why the Secrecy on the Mh17 Investigation – JAMES O'NEILL, DECEMBER 19-21, 2014
- Book by Dutch Journalist Alleges MH-17 Cover-Up - Pepe Escobar, March 9, 2014
- Ignored by western media, a new book by journalist Joost Niemoller claims that the MH-17 investigation is a farce
- Prosecutors’ probe into MH-17 disaster not trustworthy — Dutch journalist - TASS, April 04, 2015
- MH17: How the Media Failed the Victims and Their Families - James O'Neill. April 27, 2015
- Dutch Safety Board & JIT On Pot - Phil Butler, August 14, 2015
- The JIT conducts the criminal investigation and the DSB the investigation into the cause of the crash. Both investigations are conducted separately but JIT and DSB occasionally share material. In its final report the Dutch Safety Board will report on the discovered parts.”
- The MH17 13 October verdict, DSB versus Almaz-Antei, Hector Reban, October 28, 2015
30 million dollars reward for information leading to the perpetrators
September 17, 2014: "The fraud investigation company Wifka has been charged with investigating the shoot down of Malaysian Airlines flight MH17. Their client is providing 30 million dollars as a reward for information and evidence. [...] The money is securely deposited in Zurich, Switzerland. It will be paid there or in a different neutral place of the whistle-blower’s choice. Wifkas client offers to give the whistle-blower a new identity. Please contact ..." (as reported by Capital, Der Spiegel etc)
On November 24, Wifka investigator Josef Resch announces in an interview with Capital, calling for "a second Snowden", that an additional 17 million dollars will be rewarded for hints exposing the cover-up of the investigation. He calls the recent BND remarks blaming Separatists a "Schmarrn", which is a Bavarian slang word that could be translated as "poppycock". According to him, "every conspiracy theorist in the world" has contacted him by now, and some have tried to sell elaborate fakes. But he's also in contact with "serious informants".
On June 15, 2015, Capital reports that Resch was already paid for success after finding an informant that had credible information worth the reward. Resch expects "something to happen" soon. On March 15, 2016, Resch's private house was raided by the police in search of evidence for war crimes. The evidence found in that raid led to the opening of a safe at a Swiss Bank in June 2016 on behalf of the Dutch investigation.
On July 5, 2019, Resch sends a letter to JIT, the Dutch prime minister and media outlets offering to present his evidence in full to JIT in a public press conference, choosing this way due to a lack of trust in the impartiality of the investigation. The JIT replies refusing to accept the method of information transfer claiming that it could endanger the investigation if the evidence is made available to the public. The hints Resch gives about the nature of the evidence seem to point to the theory that MH17 was mistaken for Putin's plane and downed by Ukrainian forces.
- Joseph Resch: the names of those responsible for the MH17 disaster are known and will be made public - RIA , August 7, 2019 (robo-translation)
- Resch already gave an interview to the German media on the topic of MH17 and wrote a book about his investigation, but he had not previously said that he knew specific names, nor that he was ready to publish American satellite data.
Resch: I do things that we can convey to the JIT, which can be read, proved, clarified. I mean a comparative analysis of voices, handwriting, recordings. All this can be confirmed, this is not a fake. It is very surprising that this does not happen.
“Do you have any understanding of where, from what specific place this missile was launched?”
“No, I will not answer that now.” Be careful - all this will be revealed along with the evidence. OK?
“With the evidence you have?”
- With the documents that we have.
- And what is in these documents?
“These documents explain everything that happened.” This is my clear statement.
- Do you mean the documents that you have, or the document that was transferred to the Netherlands from the cell?
- Those to which we have access; not the document that was in the cell.
In September, Resch set a deadline until October 18th after which he will assume that there is no interest in his material and won't publish it anymore ever under the circumstances he demanded.
JIT, 24 May
Russian MoD, 17 September
English language video presentation on JIT BUK samples, Bellingcat videos and new alleged audio evidence (Written RT summary).