Talk:Khan al-Assal Massacre

A Lot of Soldiers
The now famous scene of soldiers laid face-down in the dirt, but all looking up at their fate: It seems there are about 30 men here, some in civilian clothes, but mostly military, overwhelmingly young - I'd say all but maybe a few are between 17 and 23. This might be a majority of the executed soldiers (the numbers and proportions still seem hazy to me). These are the same victims, at least in part, as those seen laid along a wall in large numbers after execution (as this video explains). --Caustic Logic (talk) 12:45, 1 August 2013 (UTC)

The famous thing about this famous image is the soldier apparently flashing a heroic V sign. It's taken as a clear and victoriuos FU to his executioners, a bold going out, and has gone viral in loyalist (normal) Syrian circles. It could in fact mean a few different things, but I like the sound of that version, and it's entirely possible. The man in front of him is less about politics. Sadly, he blows a kiss off of his hand, to whoever exactly and to all of it, into the space beyond - but not through - the Islamist's camera. --Caustic Logic (talk) 12:45, 1 August 2013 (UTC)

Dumped in a Pit
SANA's May 27 report mentioned perpetrators "mutilating the bodies of the martyrs and throwing them in a big hole on the outskirts of the town." A photo run at least with this Facebook post of July 27, 12:34 AM Syria time, seems to show that (see inset). Text, Google translated: "Khan honey .... Photos of the massacre following Anammelt the military personnel God Arahman the" ( خان العسل .... صور المجزرة يلي انعملت بالعسكريين الله يرحمن )

There appears to be around fifteen bodies, at least three in military garb and at least four in civilian clothes, the rest not as clear. One at least seems to be a woman in a pinkish floral dress. They are just tossed into a pile with disdain. There is debris around them as in a random pit used lightly for select garbage. But there is also clean clothing. Were they killed trying to flee? --Caustic Logic (talk) 10:38, 31 July 2013 (UTC)

Complicating UN CW Investigation

 * Naharnet Newsdesk, 24 July: U.N. Chemical Inquiry Hopes Hit by Fall of Syria's Khan al-Assal:
 * U.N. hopes of investigating chemical weapon attacks in Syria suffered a blow when rebels seized a key town, diplomats said ahead of talks starting Wednesday.
 * ''Opposition fighters took Khan al-Assal from President Bashar Assad's forces two days ahead of the arrival in Damascus of Ake Sellstrom, head of a U.N. inquiry into the use of chemical arms in the 28-month-old conflict, and U.N. disarmament affairs chief Angela Kane.
 * Khan al-Assal was the scene of a deadly March 19 attack that the government blamed on the opposition when it called for a U.N. investigation.
 * "If the government does not control Khan al-Assal then there is little chance they will let U.N. experts in," said one U.N. Security Council diplomat. "There is no opportunity for them to exploit any inquiry now," added a second council diplomat. Both diplomats spoke on condition of anonymity because the Damascus talks had not started. "But for the UN the longer this goes on the less likely it will be that there is any usable evidence to find."
 * "We have yet to receive the full Russian report relating to their evidence on Khan Al Assal," one western Security Council source told AFP. "We believe the use of chemical weapons is sanctioned and ordered by the Assad regime: Assad built up the stocks of these weapons, trained military units to use them and retains command and control over those units. So the urgent responsibility lies with him to stop them being used," added the source.
 * "We have yet to receive the full Russian report relating to their evidence on Khan Al Assal," one western Security Council source told AFP. "We believe the use of chemical weapons is sanctioned and ordered by the Assad regime: Assad built up the stocks of these weapons, trained military units to use them and retains command and control over those units. So the urgent responsibility lies with him to stop them being used," added the source.
 * "We have yet to receive the full Russian report relating to their evidence on Khan Al Assal," one western Security Council source told AFP. "We believe the use of chemical weapons is sanctioned and ordered by the Assad regime: Assad built up the stocks of these weapons, trained military units to use them and retains command and control over those units. So the urgent responsibility lies with him to stop them being used," added the source.

See also: Khan al-Assal Massacre makes UN's CW investigation impossible

As SANA reports, Ja'afari claimed today at UN GA that the "Massacre of Khan al-Asal has been committed to kill the witnesses who would testify in front of the general secretariat committee on the identity of who has used the chemical weapon in Khan al-Asal". Corroborated (that he said it) by Innercitypress who also report about the pathetic machinations with the new SNC headclown. RIA Novosti has an article about it as well, just out but in German, which made me look up the other sources. Seems a bit like a tall tale I would spontaneously say. Fadel over at SyrPer (in small bits over the days) has the line that the SAA more or less deliberately let the "rebels" take back Khan al-Assal last week because "they threw everything they had at it" and "it wasn't worth holding". And that a logistical mistake was made while leaving the area - or even some mole created confusion, MI investigates according to him - so that the people who he says were "SAA, NDF and some civilians" were caught and killed. --CE (talk) 21:59, 29 July 2013 (UTC)
 * CE, thanks! Excellent adds. The witnesses things sounds general - soldiers were gassed, soldiers are killed. But to the extent the Ottoman rats have anyone's name, they might be trying to eliminate the brain attached to that name. Or better yet, compel them to change stories on video, then have "the regime" kiill them for breaking script. We probably won't know one way or another if this is happening. --Caustic Logic (talk) 21:37, 30 July 2013 (UTC)


 * Here's an elaboration on this. It seems the conquest was indeed irrational ("throw everything at it") from a military point of view, so maybe it's not that far fetched that the aim was indeed to get rid of witnesses. Text is again a somewhat flawed translation from German but to his credit, the original writer uses an even more sophisticated German than apxwn - not easy to translate. --CE (talk) 10:59, 31 July 2013 (UTC)
 * I don't know how to assess the validity of his ruling out all strategic considerations, leaving only witness offing as a motive. And I didn't notice if there are specifics behind the claim of "numerous witnesses for the chemical weapons attack" killed. The point about supply routes as a reason seems maybe valid. True, the rought through Khananaser and Safirah area I've heard of, and not through KAA. But I'm not sure that means much considering the growing rebel control, successful attempt at blockade, and changes in supply routes. Don't get me wrong - I want to see about what he's saying. As far as clarifying the picture of the CW attack, it would be gold. But then I want to know more before being sure on such an important point, and I don't want witnesses to have been killed. It's sad for them and their families, and has a chilling effect on the truth. It could also be enough for the U.N to say, all sound logic aside, "well, that wasn't corroborated by the witness, who died instead of talking to us, so it was probably the government after all..."  --Caustic Logic (talk) 13:55, 31 July 2013 (UTC)

Murad Makhmudov and Lee Jay Walker, Modern Tokyo Times:
 * Dr. Riad Haddad, the Syrian Ambassador based in Moscow, is in no doubt that this barbaric massacre in Khan al-Assal was aimed at erasing the chemical false flag. He stated to Ria Novosti that “The main goal of this carnage which was committed by Jabhat al-Nusra and Ansar al-Khliafa brigade is killing all witnesses on the use of the chemical weapons use by the armed terrorist groups.”

Reports

 * SANA June 27: 123 Martyrs...:
 * A media source said that the death toll from the massacre that armed terrorist groups committed in Khan al-Assal in Aleppo countryside reached 123 martyrs, with many others still missing.
 * The majority of the victims are unarmed civilians, the source pointed out.
 * Medical tests helped identify 6 of the martyrs, the source said, vowing that the perpetrators will pay a heavy price for their barbarity and affirming that the Syrian people and army are on high alert.
 * The armed terrorist groups committed a genocide against a number of civilians and military personnel in Khan al-Assal town in the countryside of Aleppo.
 * Gang of the so-called Ansar al-Khilafa Brigade admitted committing the terrorist massacre in Khan al-Assal, mutilating the bodies of the martyrs and throwing them in a big hole on the outskirts of the town, in addition to incinerating a number of the martyrs' bodies.


 * AFP July 22: Syria rebels seize...


 * AFP July 27: 150 Killed...


 * Naharnet Newsdesk, 24 July: U.N. Chemical Inquiry Hopes Hit by Fall of Syria's Khan al-Assal:


 * Associated Press July 29: National Coalition condemns soldier killings ...:
 * Syria’s main exiled opposition group condemned Sunday the reported execution of scores of government soldiers by rebels in a northern Syrian village earlier this week. The Turkey-based Syrian National Coalition said in a statement that it was forming a commission to investigate the incident in Khan al-Assal. ... “Those involved in such crimes will be held accountable,” the SNC statement said.
 * Accountable! Consider how they dealt with that famous cannibal - they condemned the action, and that's all. Salem Idriss insists they can't arrest him because they have no structure and he has his own guns and paid for it himself so it'd be wrong to take it away,plus deadly, and maybe they don't want to "force him out of the revolution," and people should not focus on this one instance when thousands are dying from his stupid "revolution." (in his own words here) It seems only only the SAA is capable of keeping these people in check. --Caustic Logic (talk) 09:17, 2 August 2013 (UTC)


 * Press TV July 31: West accountable for massacre in Syria’s Khan al-Assal: Iran MP
 * A senior Iranian lawmaker says the West should be held accountable for the recent massacre of more than 120 people in Syria’s northwestern province of Aleppo by foreign-backed Takfiri groups. Alaeddin Boroujerdi said on Tuesday that the United States and its allies are responsible for the “genocide” committed by the extremist groups in the Syrian town of Khan al-Assal as they continuously arm Takfiri militants in the Arab country.


 * AP via Huffington Post, July 31: Syrian troops attack Khan al-Assal, site of alleged nerve gas attack (Sounds suspicious! What are they doing, trying to silence witnesses before investigators get there?)
 * Al-Jarba's comments (that rebels won't even consider negotiating until someone helps them start winning again on the battlefield) coincided with a new assault by Syrian government forces to regain control of a northern village that was the site of an alleged chemical weapons attack earlier this year, activists said. The push on Khan al-Assal, a village on the southwestern outskirts of the embattled city of Aleppo, comes more than a week after it was captured by the rebels. ... The Britain-based Syrian Observatory for Human Rights said 150 government soldiers were killed as Khan al-Assal fell to the rebels. The Observatory said the army attacked rebel positions Wednesday outside the village after bringing in reinforcements.


 * Syria and the Khan al-Assal massacre: Western silence, Gulf crimes and Covert Operatives Murad Makhmudov and Lee Jay Walker, Modern Tokyo Times, July 30, 2013
 * ''The Russian Foreign Ministry condemned the barbaric massacre by stating that “The gunmen of the two terrorist groups have perpetrated a brutal crime two days ago in Khan al-Asal which they captured on July 22nd, 2013.”

“The fighters of the two extremist groups have committed genocide against the captives of the Syrian officers and soldiers as well as against the pro-government civilians.”''
 * Like usual, President Obama of America, President Hollande of France, Prime Minister Erdogan of Turkey and Prime Minister Cameron of the United Kingdom remain mainly silent about this brutal massacre. These four NATO powers also have collectively agreed to allow NATO Turkey to be a conduit for al-Qaeda affiliates and other terrorist forces entering northern Syria via Turkey. Similarly, weapons to al-Qaeda terrorists, sectarian forces and covert operatives are happening based on the role of NATO Turkey. However, this seems to be bypassing a mainly compliant and propaganda based media.
 * Like usual, President Obama of America, President Hollande of France, Prime Minister Erdogan of Turkey and Prime Minister Cameron of the United Kingdom remain mainly silent about this brutal massacre. These four NATO powers also have collectively agreed to allow NATO Turkey to be a conduit for al-Qaeda affiliates and other terrorist forces entering northern Syria via Turkey. Similarly, weapons to al-Qaeda terrorists, sectarian forces and covert operatives are happening based on the role of NATO Turkey. However, this seems to be bypassing a mainly compliant and propaganda based media.

Videos

 * Mass execution of Syrian Soldiers coincide with CW investigation - Khan Al Assal - Posted by Syrian Girl, July 27, 2:28. Compilation video


 * Syrian Rebels killed 14 Assad shabiha by amazing Storm in Khan Al asal - Posted by Syria for You and Me (check their logo), July 25, 1:20. 14 bodies along a wall by a swimming pool, and inside the home there. Extremely blurry, around solar noon (1 PM).


 * 18+ Syria - Assad Suffers Heavy Casualties in Khan Al Asal Clashes with Rebels 7-21-13 IslamYVChannel3, July 21, 0:28. Standing over several killed soldiers in camouflage


 * 18+ Syria General Killed Fleeing Battlefield in Khan Al Asal as Rebels Defeat Assad Army 7-21-13 Posted by Souria2011archives, July 21. Three more dead soldiers in the bed of a truck smiled over by a crowd of rebels. The general's ID card is readable to Arabic readers.


 * 18 Syria - Assad Shabiha War Criminal Killed in Khan Al Asal Clashes With Rebels 7-22-13 Posted by SyriaDailyNews, July 24, 1:14 Desc: "Hard Core Assad Shabiha War Criminal Killed in Khan Al Asal Clashes With Rebels 7-22-13 This video shows the body of a shabiha shown torturing a 18 Syria." Possible match, possibly not.


 * Insurgents Interrogate Syrian Soldier Before Executing him - he tells them nothing Posted by Syrian Girl, July 26, 0:27. Included in Syrian Girl's compilation with subtitles.


 * +18: Syrie/Massacre: ASL/Al Nosra exécute les captifs (civils et soldats) à Khan al-Assal à Alep. Posted by Syrie*Syria* Siria سوريا July 27, 2:19. Has a good matching of several of the soldiers/men seen before execution with the piled bodies after (see around 1:55).


 * 18+ Syria #2 Red Crescent Recovers Dead Assad Soldiers in Khan Al Asal 7-25-13 Posted by Souria2011archives, July 25, 0:31

Mutilation/Castration Video
This video is probably not, or won't remain, on Youtube, or maybe Facebook, but this is the link I have, and I saved a copy. And I'll describe it so no one ever has to watch it again. It's not certainly connected to the Khan al-Assal massacre, but recent, said to be Aleppo (the text helps little otherwise, except in a religious sense), and shows two adult male victims, pants removed in humiliation and - yes, quite mutilated, like SANA said some victims were. Compared to this video still, we can see similar handling - pants removed, shorts remaining, groin injury, blood down the legs - but with two different victims. The one in the video is shirtless, different blood pattern and a slash on his legs, perhaps bearded. But his face is a bloodied mess, his chest too, slashed and stabbed many times. They pull down his shorts to revel his genitals are removed surgically, leaving a neat bloody hole with two white spots (retreating testes? bone? rocks?) set inside. They're proud of this and having a great time. The other victim in a red shirt (a different one from the soldier seen blowing a kiss before death) gets extra hate. His red shirt is pulled up, his belly slashed cross several times. I think his throat's been cut, before or after the rest I don't know. His face is mauled too, and they're stomping on it and pushing, as if to tear away his jaw (and some flesh is coming loose). Then they jam a red bar into his mouth and start prying, with the same idea (that's the hard-to-decipher still frame). People keep kicking both bodies. They lift the guy up by the bar in his mouth and animate him like a human puppet show, perhaps to mimic him performing oral sex (or neck wound sex) on the other guy (if he was still so equipped). His own genitals are gone as well, torn out horribly with the flesh all around, down the thighs a little, with a loose flap of the lower belly hanging over a raw crater big enough to hold a water-mellon. That I've seen before, following "regime shelling" in al-Houla in August 2011. Hope that helps. --Caustic Logic (talk) 09:53, 2 August 2013 (UTC) and edits --Caustic Logic (talk) 12:20, 3 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Sick, sick, sick Facebook video

Photos
Photos with the bodies on blue tarps. First is the best view of this scene, first image below. This I got second-hand from a short article, but is clearly the same scene captured in two other photos run with the original SANA report of the 27th. The first time I saw that re-posted, the first two pictures were missing but all the video grabs following remained. Then the second one re-appeared, the second scene below. A Google image search suggests just which view of the same scene is the first image, and it's not the same as image 1 here, so when I get a full-res copy of that it will be #3 at right below. --Caustic Logic (talk) 09:37, 29 July 2013 (UTC)

Syrian Arab Red Crescent Organization transport the bodies of some of the martyrs in Khan al-Assal in Aleppo Official labeled photo, residential courtyard, beautiful place, body(ies) covered. --Caustic Logic (talk) 12:03, 1 August 2013 (UTC)