Talk:Al-Bayda Massacre

SOHR Reports

 * Tartous province- Banias city:
 * ''There are reports of summary executions being committed by regime forces and pro-regime gunmen (Shabiha) in the village of al-Bayda, on the outskirts of the city, as testified by locals. the SOHr is yet to verify the deaths because of the regime control of the area and the cut off of communication there. Regime forces went on a raid and arrest campaign in the village, detaining 8 civilians, including 2 children, after storming the village. Mortars were launched onto the village during the storming. The area by the village was the site of earlier clashes today between rebels and regime forces, leading to the death of 6 regime forces and the injury of no less than 20 others, no reports yet on the number of rebels killed.
 * (as at Taldou, I suspect not enough to slow them down much as the massacres ensued) --Caustic Logic (talk) 09:41, 3 May 2013 (UTC)


 * Tartous province- Banias city:
 * There are several and conflicting reports on the number of people killed in the village of al-Bayda by regime forces and pro-regime gunmen from the nearby villages. Some testimonies indicate that more than 50 people were killed, including women and children, by summary execution, some were claimed to have been killed by knives, blunt objects and burning. Other reports put the number of dead higher, to more than 100. There are tens of villagers who have gone missing. Several houses were burnt and destroyed. It must be stated that the SOHR has not been able to verify the deaths, with full telephone and internet blockout in the village, which is under regime control.


 * We strongly urge the Red Cross and legal organisations to head to al-Bayda village to document and verify the level of death and destruction caused.


 * The city of Banias itself is witnessing a cautious calm after the gunfire and bombardment that took place in the southern neighbourhoods.


 * Violence in the Banias area is extremely worrying since its demographics easily lend to sectarian communal violence.


 * May 16 update: 145 civilians (34 children, 40 women, 71 men) killed in the Banias massacre: Includes alleged details and a horrible photo of about 20 mangled bodies in a courtyard, including small children. I didn't even look at it yet - not in the mood. --Caustic Logic (talk) 12:22, 19 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Includes alleged details:
 * 145 civilians (34 children, 40 women, 71 men) killed in the Banias massacre
 * The SOHR has now documented 145 victims killed in the Banias massacre, this comes after receiving evidence proving that the dozens of civilians who were in the torched houses or under the rubble were secretly buried by the Syrian security forces.
 * The security forces and gunmen from the popular committees stormed the Ras al-Nabe' neighbourhood on the morning of 3/5/2013, which lies in the souther part of Banias, after the impoverished neighbourhood was violently bombarded causing the collapse and burning of several homes. It is then that they committed the massacre, many of the victims were summarily executed and some were killed with knives and blunt objects. The dead include 34 children (all under 16, some of them were babies and toddlers) and 40 women (including old women over 60). This massacre is considered to be one of the most horrendous war crimes committed by the Syrian security services and the pro-regime gunmen, since the victims were targeted for their religious background.
 * No flies! Photo would have to be taken soon after death.
 * Also of note is that there is no blood and no apparent cause of death. Looking at this picture alone, it is with in the realm of possibility that these people are facing death. (See below.) -- Petri Krohn (talk) 14:11, 19 May 2013 (UTC)

DPA
Via Moon of Alabama: German news agency DPA reports details about the "earlier clashes" mentioned by SOHR:
 * Activists said troops attacked al-Bayda after a bus carrying pro-regime militants, known as Shabiha, was attacked, killing at least seven and wounding more than 30.

--CE (talk) 16:30, 4 May 2013 (UTC)

SyrPer
Already on Thursday, he reports:


 * TARTOUS: Not much usually happens here in this bastion of pro-government citizens. But, the rats are desperate and are looking for other places to settle. No such luck.


 * 2 warehouses filled with weapons were destroyed by the SAA and militia.


 * At Al-Baydha Village, heavy machine guns were seized and turned over to our brave NDF. There were automatic assault rifles, components for RPGs, RPGs, IEDs and very advanced communication equipment that will remain unused. The owners of the 2 warehouses claim ignorance. But just give them some time with the AI people and they'll warble arias.


 * At Al-Marqab, site of the magnificent coastal fortress, SAA killed 19 insects. Their names are being collected by Wael. He writes that they appear foreign. There are Saudis in the group.


 * In Banyaas itself, at the Al-Nabi' Quarter, we killed 17 rats:


 * 'Ali Mashnooq (Well, he never made it to the gallows)
 * Safwaan Qaramaan
 * Mahmoud Al-'Aashiq
 * Raami Jameel
 * Nabeel Haddaad
 * 'Ali Humaydaan


 * The rest had no papers.

--CE (talk) 16:59, 4 May 2013 (UTC)

Syrianews

 * SAA Commits Massacres in Bayda & Qussayr Countryside – Arabi Souri, May 4, 2013

TV

 * Al Manar 3 May 2013 from Bayda and Qussayr (4:55)
 * Notice how they show the same scene from the central square twice, first with a white pickup and bodies, then with the bodies gone and the bodies gone – with SAA taking cover behind the building. Some rebel counter attack must have happened in between. -- Petri Krohn (talk) 03:33, 6 May 2013 (UTC)
 * ...or maybe first video is activist footage from time before SAA arrived. -- Petri Krohn (talk) 03:42, 6 May 2013 (UTC)

Newspapers

 * Thousands flee Syrian city of Banias fearing new 'massacre' – Associated Press, 4 May 2013
 * Images of Sabra and Shatila in Banias – The Daily Star, Lebanon, May 04, 2013
 * An Atrocity in Syria, With No Victim Too Small – New York Times, May 14, 2013

Photos

 * First pictures of Al Bayda village massacres by LccSy
 * 750 martyrs in Syria today!

April 2011

 * Syria Presses Crackdown in Two Cities on Coast – New York Times, April 12, 2011 (mirror)

United States
The reported massacre is said to have influenced the U.S. to again air the possibility of directly arming the rebels. Next batch of people called-in as killed by Shabiha and never investigated will lead to yet another airing and eventually maybe some guns. --Caustic Logic (talk) 09:41, 3 May 2013 (UTC)


 * State Dept'spokesman Jen Psaki, May 4: Massacre in al-Bayda
 * The United States is appalled by horrific reports that more than 100 people were killed May 2 in gruesome attacks on the coastal town of al-Bayda, Syria. Regime and Shabiha forces reportedly destroyed the area with mortar fire then stormed the town and executed entire families, including women and children.
 * They make it sound exactly like the Houla massacre. Let's hope it was more like Tremseh. --Caustic Logic (talk) 08:03, 5 May 2013 (UTC)


 * I thought the Al Bayda Massacre was in Libya! Yeah, History repeats itself, first as tragedy, second as farce. -- Petri Krohn (talk) 13:03, 3 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Yeah, it's just a common name, especially for more or less coastal towns. "The White." Could be referring to limestone, as I think it did in Libya's "the white (monastery)." As if it matters/for a side thing, any related parallels could go here, but aside from dead soldiers, the basic details are pretty different. So other than linguistically and maybe geographically, little repetition here, aside from the whole "Arab Spring / people's uprising" correlations.   --Caustic Logic (talk) 08:03, 5 May 2013 (UTC)
 * It's here. Astonishingly, white like snow in summer! -- Petri Krohn (talk) 03:25, 6 May 2013 (UTC)

Baniyas Massacre
Should this have its own page? According to the BBC (mainstream) version from activists, "Activists said at least 77 people - 20 from the same family - were killed, a day after 72 died in nearby al-Bayda." Sorry that's all I have. I think yeah, a page for each, closely linked. But I'll ask as a stalling maneuver. --Caustic Logic (talk) 12:30, 6 May 2013 (UTC)


 * For now, I think we should keep these together. Maybe we can move this page to Baniyas Massacre.
 * This may just be rebel FUD. The Al-Bayda Massacre was shown to be a hoax. The response: it did not happen there, but here. You just did not look in the right place. -- Petri Krohn (talk) 12:39, 8 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Wait, are you saying they're passing off one massacre as two, or at least that there is only one? They are, as I note, the same basic size and right by each other in time and space. But if only one, it was all in Al-Bayda, with that central square, right? I would guess they might like naming Banyas better as the locale (close enough, arguably) and its coastal/Sunni implications. Not that I suspect rebels had the run of the place or its docks... But we have the right town for the page, not the wrong one then. But we could use more detail. I suppose a search for documentation of each alleged massacre would help. If there's only documentation for one, that's probably all there is. --Caustic Logic (talk) 23:05, 8 May 2013 (UTC)

This seems to be evolving into a big, 100+ massacre of children. (At least according to pro-revolutionary social media). We should start collecting all the photos and videos and uploading them here. I can now say one scene is staged. -- Petri Krohn (talk) 12:58, 8 May 2013 (UTC)
 * I've been meaning to ... I will in time (not quick enough to be timely) gather some videos, perhaps looking for Baniyas too as explained right above. --Caustic Logic (talk) 23:05, 8 May 2013 (UTC)

Video

 * Pro-Government "Syrian Resistance" Figure Boasts of Banias Operation – SASNewsNetwork
 * Pro-regime TV claims Banias sweep –  SASNewsNetwork, May 3, 2013
 * This video is from the ridge west of al-Bayda, i can identify the building on central square. This video shows a scene from the same hill. -- Petri Krohn (talk) 14:20, 8 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Banias - Beidha - the crimes Assad gangs families of the village 252 013 c 3 + +18 – May 3, 2013 by Latakia Coordination Committee
 * Beida - Banias | massacre against women, children and young people "slaughtered with knives" +20 – May 3, 2013, SouriaFree
 * Storm the village Beida in Banias by gangs Assad and the Lebanese Hezbollah militia Lat – May 4, Baniase Aseel
 * Shows bodies in workshop. Later photo shows same workshop with bodies burnt.
 * +18 Baniyas Massacre Banias top of the spring - the massacre of humanity has never seen c 05/16/2013
 * Warning: These bodies have beeed dead for three days. Bloated with maggots – Libya style.

Mihrac Ural

 * Baida Operation Leader Identified as Being a Turkish National


 * Banias massacre suspect claims Israel behind Reyhanlı bombings Erdogan has accused him of being the mastermind of that bombing as well as the Banias massacre, where Erdogan claims 700 civilians were slaughtered. He really lost it. Don't think Ural has any insight into who commited the bombing and blaming Israel is kind of the reflex position in these circles, but it's kind of interesting what he says about Banias - denies any involvement, of course. Josh Landis has written one of his pathetic orientalist tirades quoting Ural out of context making it look as if he was talking about "ethnic cleansing" in the video when he obviously meant getting rid of armed "traitors". He confirms that in the above article and I pointed it out yesterday rather politely in a comment to Landis' article which contained the word Orientalism ... awaits moderation. Still. hahaha. Would be comment 15 of already 90 or so, so I don't think it will make it through. That guy is a master of being constantly wrong since two years, although I think he's not doing it intentionally like so many others. ;oD --CE (talk) 14:51, 14 May 2013 (UTC)


 * Being right and earning a living are two different things. -- Petri Krohn (talk) 20:44, 14 May 2013 (UTC)


 * Yeah! He must have been responsible for the Reyhanlı bombings too. -- Petri Krohn (talk) 22:45, 14 May 2013 (UTC)


 * Turkey draws closer to illuminating Reyhanlı attack as four more detained How can anyone believe a word of this? -- Petri Krohn (talk) 22:45, 14 May 2013 (UTC)


 * Combined with the ridiculous censorship it isn't easy as this op-ed in Today's Zaman, which is a Gülen movement hence pro-AKP publication, shows. --CE (talk) 23:29, 14 May 2013 (UTC)

Syriangirl
This was just posted on Facebook by Syriangirl. I understand these to be not her own observations, but she is reposting comments made on her wall by others. -- Petri Krohn (talk) 08:51, 11 May 2013 (UTC)


 * Here is the information i have received from sources inside and close to Syria.


 * Kinan Zeno
 * So all this non-ending arguement about Banias.To sum it up here is what happened guys.. my sources are friends from Banias. I heard many stories but im sharing only whats in common in all stories.
 * This guy Omar Biaasie, the Imam of Bayda mosque.. he was a big revhead. Then a while ago. They made a lie about him that SAA killed him. So he appeared on the Syrian TV saying they are lying and its part of the propaganda. Apparently FSA hated him for this. And now it was the right time to kill him and his family for real this time to blame the SAA and whine about it like they always do.
 * The other family that was killed was his sister-Manar Biaasie-, her husband and their kids. also proves that him and his family were the ones targeted. btw Bayda isnt all opposition. There are some pro people there too.
 * SAA patrol was besieged near Al-Bayda first, 4 were martyred. Then more army came to help them. Before the army got there, terrorists were in control of the town and did their massacre killing the 2 families of Baiaase. Army came, surrounded the Bayda. Killed the terrorists. 9 soldiers were martyred in this operation. Since there were army martyrs, it means the town was infected with many rats. So whoever killed those soldiers also killed the 2 families. They've done it too many times already in Hawleh and Karm-Zieton. Maybe a desperate try to ruin SAA recent achievements and accuse us of being sectarian which in turn justifies their crimes. Please be careful guys and don't get too excited posting stuff before you're sure. You're just doing them a great favor for free.
 * check this its from an opposition page> it says names the people who died in the massacre.. they know exactly who they killed.
 * http://www.facebook.com/Saned.N.N/posts/648416878518109


 * Sabina Chia
 * Syriangirl I have family there! this is bullshit!
 * The fact is this started circulating when Abdel Salim Khadam's people who are the main sponsors of terrorism in the are shot dead two children from Banias! THE REASON THEY PUT THIS TRAP WAS TO COVER THEMSELVES BECAUSE THEY SHOT 2 CHILDREN ,ON THEIR BALCONY (ROOF) IN BANIAS!!!!!!!!THE CHILDREN WERE FROM MY FAMILY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


 * Arabi Souri
 * What do you know about those militias? I know them. I have friends among them, i was following them from Latakia countryside to Bayda when they were NOT allowed by SAA to go in due to the sectarian and local tribal sensitivity in that area, yet I refused to comment as tensions are still there.

Baby girl with burnt feet
There are several pictures of this girl. Some with charred feet, later ones show her lined up under the tree utility pole with only stumps left. -- Petri Krohn (talk) 14:39, 19 May 2013 (UTC)

Pile of bodies in courtyard
The SOHR photo (published earlier on May 8th by Syrian Revolution Digest, and here on May 5th and May 4th) of the pile is the earliest, taken at around noon. It is possible this photo is taken by the perpetrators of the massacre.

Another photo (published earlier) shows the photo some two hours hours later. There is no movement in most of the bodies, confirming they are indeed dead and not acting out a massacre for the cameras. The girl in the red "28" shirt has been slightly moved. She is later seen lined up next to the pole. The woman in a black dress with a blue face has disappeared. The boy in a striped red shirt, originally lying on top of her, has been thrown further back in the pile. The body shows rigor mortis as his stretched arm is still in the same position.

I do not think the people died or were killed in situ. There is no blood, no bullet holes on bodies or on walls. No apparent cause of death. More likely the bodies were dumped on the spot after death. The most likely explanation is that the people suffocated in a fire. The case has thus similarities with the alleged Aqrab Massacre. -- Petri Krohn (talk) 14:55, 19 May 2013 (UTC)

continued... The way the bodies are entangled is a mystery. Most likely they were dropped from a roof or balcony above the spot. In fact, my cache of photos has two photos filmed from above. (One of them is here in the Syrian Revolution Digest post.) The photos from above, showing the 2 o'clock configuration, show the boy in the striped red shirt and the blue-faced woman on top of the pile, highly entangled with other bodies. It is as if the woman had been pulled from the pile in the noon picture. This would mean that the SOHR noon photo would have to be taken a day later.

Also of interest is that the photos from show physical woulds. The men have some blood stains, another woman has her face slit in halve, most likely with a saber. -- Petri Krohn (talk) 15:54, 19 May 2013 (UTC)

This video, published May 3rd, shows that same family dead, at night, possible inside their house in the same pile, but in yet another arrangement. -- Petri Krohn (talk) 21:42, 19 May 2013 (UTC)

Timeline
Syrian street at http://sy-street.net/ reports on May 2nd
 * Violent clashes near the Banias and the army closed the international road
 * Media sources reported that violent clashes took place on Thursday morning, May 2 / May in the village of egg to Banias between the elements of the Syrian Arab Army and armed men were present in the village.
 * The sources said that the clashes began about seven o'clock in the morning and continues until now, and this is why the army to cut the international road between Tartus and Banias.
 * The sources added that the army carried out raids and arrested a number of wanted men in the same village.

Longer story from the same site, with photos:
 * High-ranking military source of the "Syrian street": So would respond to any armed rebellion in safe areas
 * Syrian army was able to control the town, "Beida" in Banias on Thursday, May 2, 2013. And the number of people killed dozens of militants, as dozens of them surrendered the Army was the confiscation of large quantities of weapons.

Al Arabia: 2 May 2013 KSA 22:22 - GMT 19:22
 * Watchdog reports ‘massacre’ in Bayda, at least 50 dead

YallaSouriya 8:08 pm on May 2, 2013
 * #Syria, Latakia, Banyas, young men arrrested (photo)

YallaSouriya 10:23 pm on May 2, 2013
 * #Syria, Picture from #BaydaMassacre today taken from an pro-regime page.

Facebook post by Bristol Justice for Syria on May 2, 10,29 pm
 * At 6 in the morning Assad forces surrounded Al-Bayyda in Banays, they raided homes and arrested more than 200 people including women and children. Women were raped in groups in the streets in front of their families by the regime forces. The 200 arrested were executed in the streets and then burned.
 * ''The international community has been silent and let Assad continue committing genocides and ethnic clearing of people in Homs and other cities to pave the way for Assad to divide Syria!!!!
 * First photo of the massacre to be released by activists

YallaSouriya 2:27 am on May 3, 2013
 * https://yallasouriya.wordpress.com/2013/05/02/pro-assad-pages-on-facebook-admitting-to-and-celebrating-the-massacre-in-bayda-by-assad-forces/

YallaSouriya 2:21 am on May 3, 2013
 * From a pro-regime FB page. These are “terrorists” (civilians) who were field-executed in Bayda, #Banias today. #Syria