File talk:Khryaschuvate dead.jpg

But wait, the Ukrainian army driver who jumped out unharmed ... how would he sneak in with a rebel convoy? No, this is interesting, and this story is worth highlighting with a revised front page for Attack on convoy near Novosvetlovaka at least. (may be a little slow) 34 killed, damn. Including a girl, and six rebel martyrs just ignored. Kiev didn't claim any losses from their military did they? Implicitly someone died when the first truck was hit, but did they even list a single alleged fatality? Highest count I heard was 17+ civilians dead, no mention of army losses.--Caustic Logic (talk) 13:41, 27 February 2015 (UTC)
 * Very unlikely anybody would jump out unharmed in Grad or mortar strike; looks like it was all-'rebel' convoy. Of course the Novorossian 'rebels' would not intentionally shell civilians or themselves, as this is not how they operate; but proving something beyond doubt will be difficult. --Resup (talk) 15:58, 27 February 2015 (UTC)
 * Indeed, it's a silly claim that guy made. Silly enough, in fact, that that was a joke. No total proof, I suppose, but I'm going to see if Kiev claims all their soldiers jumped out in time. --Caustic Logic (talk) 00:30, 28 February 2015 (UTC)

Here's a weird thing, wanted to post it on the Facebook page but my join isn't confirmed yet (?) Look at the dates on the plaque - it says the last person died 16 days after the first and presumably most deaths - and those it says were on August 13, not 18. It's possible this is a whole different thing, but I think it's the same incident, but we just let Ukraine give us the wrong date. And check out what this puts it into the time frame for: August 15 report of a Russian military column in disguise, painted white (not white flags) lo look peaceful, but seen crossing from Russia and then destroyed by Ukrainian artillery. Poroshenko says it was done "last night," so the 14th. We hear Aidar Battalion took over Novosvetlovaka on the 13th, and a few days later Aidar leader Melnychuk mentioned that "terrorists escape from the city under the guise of civilians!" Two different versions of the same story perhaps? --Caustic Logic (talk) 09:46, 28 February 2015 (UTC)


 * Worth checking: do we know of any victim lists or single names published at the time? Do they appear on this plaque? At least then we can presume it's supposed to be the same story. I suspect it is, but would be good to get some confirmation. --Caustic Logic (talk) 09:46, 28 February 2015 (UTC)


 * Maybe I'm missing something but I can't see why you presume that "most deaths" happened on the 13th. Could be that one person died on the 13th, one on the 29th and all the others on the 18th, couldn't it? Theoretically. --CE (talk) 12:25, 28 February 2015 (UTC)
 * Yes, that's one area in question. The poster directed me here, where we've both asked a local guy. This mentions the girl and her family (4 total, all born in November! Just odd) and gives the standard date. The plaque, not sure where it's from, what it says it shows even, but... implied was the victims of this attack on this truck and convoy that killed 34 to Kiev's vague "dozens." I thought it for sure was that, so start date should be date of attack and almost all deaths, but it would be 5 days early. But ... maybe it's all town victims from the Aidar attack of 8-13 forward. Actually, that's pretty likely. But Qs are in, so we'll see. --Caustic Logic (talk) 12:56, 28 February 2015 (UTC)
 * Well, on the file page the description indeed says that the memorial is for "28 civilians and 6 militiamen killed in thе dark August days". All from that village. In different events apparently. --CE (talk) 13:32, 28 February 2015 (UTC)