Talk:Houla Victims: Shumariyeh/Shomaliya

Slogan Translation
Crowd-sourcing time! Or, is it already solved? I'm looking at it, and I brought "Felix" into the loop. It's not automatic going. Two more heads reside here so far. Again, the words seen at a massacre site that could be the Alawite Abdullah family:



I was trying to look at it letter-by-letter, and you can try too, just pull up an alphabet chart and follow along. But even that's not so clear. Is this one letter or two? Middle of one word or beginning of next (affects the form greatly)? Is that a loop or a hump? Etc. Bottom line first. I thought that reads, starting, Aleph, Kaaf (K sound, written poorly, in the alone form as seen [here])... etc. Blundering. Thankfully, Felix suggests لجيش, Al-Jeesh, army. The kaaf would be a Jiin (middle-of-word form), making the J sound, but with some extra thing above it I can't explain. So that might be what's written. Following, I had no guess yet, but Felix suggests الحرة - Hurrah - free. Sloppily written, I can see this as one of the clearest fits, if missing the last thingee.

So, "something, Free Army" might be what's written. The "something." I thought it might be Syrian; the first part might be a siin, and it could almost be "Syria" something, but the word "Syrian" it doesn't seem to be. And of course "Free Army" without "Syrian" is how it's usually said around there anyway. Felix points to a video title مذبحة داريا  من هنا مر الموت (Darya massacre from here over the death). The part "من هنا مر" "from here over" (per Google translate) is a very good fit with what we see. What it means is not totally sure. Possibly "from here on out," "forever."

In the video title, I don't know what that means, but what could be "from here on out, Free Army" is painted at the scene of this heinous crime. Can't spell out the Google pronunciation for that first part, but it ends with an "ah" sound, a handy rhyme with Hurrah, giving the translation plausibility as a slogan (the 5-4 syllable mismatch is not a problem - rhythm fixes things like that instinctively). --Caustic Logic (talk) 08:22, 4 November 2012 (UTC)


 * Translation: SFA Rulez! -- Petri Krohn (talk) 22:11, 4 November 2012 (UTC)


 * A simple Google search for "من هنا مر" shows this to be a SFA slogan. I will start with less important:
 * #3 in the search results is this photo on Flickr, with the text "من هنا مر التاريخ" which Google translates as "From here throughout history". I guess this means simply "forever" (This is the only top result that is nopt related to the Syrian insurgency.)
 * Result #4 is this photo on Flickr by DoumaRevolution, another massacre channel.
 * Result #5 is this FSA photo from April 22, 2012 on Flickr of a captured Syrian tank, with the slogan "من هنا مر الجيش الحر", which Google translates to "From here over the army free".
 * Result #2 is the Darya massacre video from a pro-SFA YouTube channel you mentioned.
 * Result #1 is getting too close for comfort! It is this YouTube video of a damaged mosque by SHAMSNN from May 11, 2011. If I remember correctly SHAMSNN has also published Houla Media Office material. The latest video, published just half an hour ago, features our Media office host Suleiman.
 * The whole phrase might be من هنا مر التتار which Google translates to "From here over the Tartars". -- Petri Krohn (talk) 23:26, 4 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Searching for the whole phrase "من هنا مر الجيش الحر" brings an interesting video as result #3. You can see a very similar graffiti at 2:19.
 * Shabiha break and steal and then write from here over the army free – Published on Aug 29, 2012 by كنت شيعيا للاسف
 * I do not see the Syrian Arab Army stealing or writing graffiti, but how do I know – maybe they did it just before chasing away the SFA. -- Petri Krohn (talk) 00:10, 5 November 2012 (UTC)

If you read the US Army counter insurgency manuals you see that one of the most important tasks of the "regime" forces is to paint over rebel graffiti. The army or the shabiha do not go around spraying graffiti – it is unlikely they even have spray paint cans. Graffiti is always a clear sign of rebel presence. -- Petri Krohn (talk) 00:45, 5 November 2012 (UTC)
 * The law of reverse psychology I just now codofoed says as soon as you can say it's a clear sign, it can also be used by others for that same reason. I tend to agree with you, that this is the rebels just being arrogant, knowing that even if SANA shows it, the world will dismiss that as a "regime" lie and they won't suffer a bit. And it still sends its message to the people inside Syria who surely know what it means. I don't see how to prove it, however. The manual is good evidence, but far from airtight. The example digging was quite useful. Thanks! Looks like we (Felix) called it right. --Caustic Logic (talk) 04:43, 5 November 2012 (UTC)

Fancy buildings
The supposed location has some extremely fancy buildings. Does getting paid well by the government make you an Alewite? -- Petri Krohn 11:02, 6 October 2012 (EST)

Not necessarily, but I imagine being an Alawite and living in a fancy building might make you Shabiha. Not thew additions coming up in a few minutes. --Caustic Logic 18:22, 6 October 2012 (EST)

Names
Dropped the name of the place into youtube (corrected me to Shoumariyeh), here is Syrian TV with victim names. Sounds something like Mohammed Al-Binawi with his wife and six children, and ... no idea how to spell that ... with his son. CE 11:53, 6 October 2012 (EST)


 * Very good, had a listen. First name might be Mohammed Abu Nehi (?) and the other I hear "Rata Velo" (?). Will be added shortly. The video of course is highly valuable stuff I'm just now seeing. --Caustic Logic 18:24, 6 October 2012 (EST)


 * And of course, it could be: "The source mentioned that the terrorists brutally killed Mohammad Abdul-Nabi Abdullah, his wife and six sons in addition to the citizen Rateb al-Oulo along with his son." (SANA May 26) The video specifies the son's name as something like "Intha Villij";) --Caustic Logic 18:55, 6 October 2012 (EST)

Map?
There is a map in this blog with the al-Shumariya area highlighted. It may be worth transcribing and transliterating the Arabic script. --
 * Al Houleh Massacre: An Everlasting Agony

Video
This must be the video: حمورية (Hmouria) seems to be somewhere near Damascus. -- Petri Krohn (talk) 21:41, 18 November 2012 (UTC)
 * In Hmouria 1 6 2012 massacre of an entire family at the hands of Assad forces (‫حمورية 1 6 2012 مجزرة بحق عائلة كاملة على يد قوات الأسد‬)
 * Hmouria 06/01/2012 massacre of an entire family at the hands of forces Assad 1