Talk:Russian airstrikes in Syria

Tired now, but maybe we should give this a timeline format with brief descriptions of events and links to claims and counter-claims. I guess it'll be around with us for some time. Nice start, Petri. --CE (talk) 23:07, 30 September 2015 (UTC)

Russian jet shot down
This is obviously the big news now, and it's in/about Syria. Resup has some notes added on the front page. It's probably worth it's own page, but ... 1) I'm not feeling up to it now, and later it'll be even less of a new issue. (4-day weekend coming up though...) 2) It may not be controversial enough to be a very valuable page (that is, our best value is analyzing and clarifying issues that are or should be controversial when possible, tearing down lies). Just relating news most people already know/getting our own handle on it and a place to link to, are not that valuable. 3) Other thoughts before anyone jumps into it? --Caustic Logic (talk) 10:25, 25 November 2015 (UTC)
 * Agreed; unsure on best formatting of this material. Somehow all this may be a turning point, to colder climates. There seem to be no resolution or backing off options available.--Resup (talk) 12:13, 25 November 2015 (UTC)


 * I guess we can add analysis, even easily. MoA has info, and comments, and a map Turkey provided. Isn't this in the same locale as Turkish Downing of a Syrian Helicopter? Same little sore thumb of Turkey sticking in awkwardly, easy to barely cross, and their favorite ambush spot for enemy aircraft. --Caustic Logic (talk) 13:16, 25 November 2015 (UTC)

Russian Jet Shot Down?
Pretty sure it's fake in ether location or date. Certainly not a Russian Jet in Syria in the past day

Supposed Russian jet shot down

Some Discussion

Any idea when and where? --Charles Wood (talk) 20:37, 1 October 2015 (UTC)


 * Apparently the sound is dubbed in and the video may show more than one aircraft. Sound Source

al-Habait Sisters
Allegations of two photogenic sisters killed by a Russian bomb sounds suss - Especially as they feature in a related White Helmets video.

Liveleak Posting by Creosote

Extended and recut White Helmets Video

There is another version of the WH video with night-time outside shots of wreckage but no concrete dust. Can't locate it just yet

(It's not actually branded White Helmets but it features them and the presenter seems to be embedded with them) --Charles Wood (talk) 03:19, 2 October 2015 (UTC)

Russian Helicopters Shot Down

 * South Front: Syrian Terrorists Argue 3 Russian Helicopters Shot Down… Post ‘Apache’ Photos I'm not a hardware expert ... but if these are US-made helicopters ... Quite likely recycled images, wrongly chosen, or ? --Caustic Logic (talk) 02:17, 12 October 2015 (UTC)


 * At least one is from wikipedia and dates back to 2003 Iraq - U.S. Army AH-64 Apache that crashed in central Iraq in November 2003. --Charles Wood (talk) 02:25, 12 October 2015 (UTC)


 * That was quick. Best guess then is all are fake, and this was some fake story. If not, there should be follow-up news. Until I hear that, done. --Caustic Logic (talk) 02:37, 12 October 2015 (UTC)


 * For completeness the helicopter on fire was Damascus 2013 Assad Helicopter Shot Down


 * I can't match the third photo but it's an AH-64 with radar dome and it looks very much like Iraq. The account these were posted on has been closed by Twitter. Done and Dusted! --Charles Wood


 * As a matter of some amusement, there are at least 3 or 4 fake videos in Liveleak each day showing alleged Russian Syria shootdowns, or alleged Russian Syrian victims. (talk) 02:48, 12 October 2015 (UTC)

Why airstrikes?
Airstrikes make newsworthy visuals, but I'd think unlikely to dramatically alter things on the ground, just by themselves. However this establishes significant external pro-government presence, de-facto makes certain areas out of reach for NATO planes, and makes replacement of Assad, by forceful means, rather improbable ... The best which can come out of this is a stronger drive to find a negotiated solution (but enough bad options too, of course). --Resup (talk) 22:33, 5 October 2015 (UTC)
 * Peskov: "political solution is the ultimate goal of all Russian actions, this is also the only possible goal of the international community." Similar but more nuanced line taken by Putin; also mentions proposal of Hollande that Syrian government and FSA act jointly against terrorism. --Resup (talk) 20:31, 7 October 2015 (UTC)